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Discussion in 'Reader Polls' started by Dark Lord, Nov 4, 2001.
Are you really debating whether Star Wars is true science fiction?
...said the guy posting on a horror message board.
i am mystified. The Sisth Sense is (to me) an excellent film. I really think his latter films have clouded some peoples view of the film.
I voted The Shining. Now that to me is a brutally overrated film.
...said the guy posting on how excellent Sixth Sense is which is written and directed by a Golden Turkey Award winner.
Well Alien is about how a company is interested in extra terrestrial life for profit gain (over the life of its own human employees). There's science fiction themes in there, beyond the setting. You could probably make a better arguement against E.T. Make him a magical troll out of time and you could have a nearly identical plot.
As I pointed out with the Death Star, it's the gravity of the situation that makes it much more profound and something only science fiction genre can deliever. A weapon that can blow up entire planets is unprescedent. After all it's copied from E.E. Smith's Lensman series and that is considered science fiction. Lucas just change a few names around (and in some cases didn't even bother doing that) then bingo you've got 'Star Wars.' Doesn't really change the genre. The whole plot revolves around this science fiction convention.
Other examples of common themes with Star Wars would be H.G. Welle's The War in the Air and The World Set Free. Both considered Sci-Fi.
None of that really matters because, again and simply put, in the STAR WARS universe magic exists. As defined by the father's of the genre, Magic and Science absolutely cannot co-exist in Science Fiction. It would defeat it's purpose. The only caveat one can give to this is the one which Arthur C. Clarke posited, where any technology sufficiently more advanced than ours would appear to be magic. This is clearly not the case with "The Force". It isn't technology, it's a divine energy that's tapped by the minds of the devout. It's no different than witchcraft. Ergo, NOT Sci-fi.
Could it be that people actually make films that exist in more than one genre?
Yes, but not in this case, because there is already a genre that exists that encompasses STAR WARS perfectly. It's named "Science Fantasy"!
Sixth Sense. Not even a horror film in my opinion.
Well George Lucas did develop a biological explaination with midi-chlorians, a biological weapon taken to the next extreme as it were. It could be argued that it was his intention to make it science fiction over fantasy, but was not aware enough of the distintions to define A New Hope in such universal terms.
Also magic in and of itself hasn't been "disproven" by science, therefore logically science fiction could prove it just as easily as it's proved reversing the polarity can solve any technical problem.
Science can't disprove God, either. Magic is by definition outside the realm of science. As soon as magic is proven it becomes Science. Midi-Chloreans doesn't make The Force any less magical. All that does is tell us that those with Midi-Chloreans can wield the force better than those who can't. That isn't any different than in any random Fantasy book where the main character has fantastic powers because his or her mother just happened to be a powerful witch. Just because wizardry is in his DNA doesn't mean that the Harry Potter series all of a sudden becomes Science Fiction, does it? And don't forget Anakin's supposed virgin birth: another fine example of how far into the realm of Fantasy the series is.
Silence of the Lambs and Sixth Sense, both bore me senseless.
Let's just call STAR WARS "a movie" and be done with it.
There is no factual basis whatsoever that "The Force" exists. George Lucas completely made it up. I suppose I could buy it if only one race in the Universe could use it as part of their biological makeup, like how Superman's powers come from the rays of a yellow sun, but it doesn't work like that. Every race in the Universe is capable of using it. The force ISN'T an example of future tech (as the Clarke reference relates to). It's an example of a non-existent form of energy.
Again, there IS no force in reality. It's made up. It's pure fantasy with not even a single IOTA of true scientific factual basis behind it, not one single credible theory or even a hypothesis, which is EXACTLY what it would need to be considered TRUE Science Fiction.
Out of that list - Sixth Sense. No question.
The IMDB list has change some since the poll was posted.
1. 8.7 Psycho (1960) 119,506
2. 8.5 Alien (1979) 149,382
3. 8.5 The Shining (1980) 144,891
4. 8.4 Aliens (1986) 141,792
5. 8.3 Les diaboliques (1955) 11,172
6. 8.3 Jaws (1975) 116,083
7. 8.1 Faust - Eine deutsche Volkssage (1926) 3,524
8. 8.1 Låt den rätte komma in (2008) 22,480
9. 8.1 The Thing (1982) 61,526
10. 8.1 Frankenstein (1931) 19,191
I suppose whatever is hot at the time makes it on the list...I don't hate on the sixth sense as much as most people, I actually liked it. But does it deserve to go in the top 10, hell no. I feel the same way about this new list. Let the Right one in was pretty good, but is it top 10 material? pfft. no way.
Out of that list, since I haven't seen LtR1I yet, I'll say Jaws. Which isn't even a horror film, it's a Hollywood Drama with Adventure or Thriller highlights.
Huh, you know that ain't such a bad list. Considering this isn't a specific person's list but instead the results from a mass poll, I'd say it's pretty damn good.
I'm kinda surprised Frankenstein snuck in ahead of Bride of Frankenstein. Although the first is my favorite of the two, it seems like the vast majority prefered Bride.
The Sixth Sense is highly overrated.