Which film series do you want them to make a sequel to the most

Discussion in 'Reader Polls' started by ThisEvilBastard, Jun 16, 2013.

?

Same

Poll closed Sep 11, 2013.
  1. The original Evil Dead trilogy

    7 vote(s)
    20.6%
  2. A nightmare on elm street original

    4 vote(s)
    11.8%
  3. Friday the 13th the original

    11 vote(s)
    32.4%
  4. Halloween original

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  5. Saw

    2 vote(s)
    5.9%
  6. Your chose

    10 vote(s)
    29.4%
  1. Workshed

    Workshed a.k.a. Villyan Shit

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    Ash's stump superconducts to any nearby chainsaw. This is established in the alternate timeline between 200 BC and Dracula A.D. 1972.
     
  2. Fistfuck

    Fistfuck Slowest to 2000 posts

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    [​IMG]
     
  3. Grim

    Grim Well-Known Member

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    I have an image from the series tattooed on my arm, so no, it wasn't an insult, but I do recognize what the series is, for the most part. 12 films full of tits and gore whose sole purpose in being made was to make money. I love the films dearly, but come on, let's be honest about the depth of the story in these films.
     
  4. Grim

    Grim Well-Known Member

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    Hey man, it's your fan timeline. Physics and history be damned. :lol:
     
  5. ThisEvilBastard

    ThisEvilBastard Banned Mofo

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    It's plausable to me
     
  6. ThisEvilBastard

    ThisEvilBastard Banned Mofo

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    Their's more to them.
     
  7. Grim

    Grim Well-Known Member

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    Please, fill me in on the depth of the series and the moral dilemmas and decisions the characters face, other than "should I smoke this weed and drink this beer, and then have sex?" or "should I go out into the woods alone after hearing that curious noise?"

    Part 6 is really the only one that attempted to do anything particularly creative and most of that is wink-wink Scream-esque stuff that only horror fans would get. Part 4 stands out for the shear brutality present in the film and the purveying sense of dread that never really leaves, but again, this has little to do with the characters or plot of the film and more to do with the director's skill to elevate a rather mediocre script into a good film through visuals, sound, and music.

    I think most of the films in the series are decent horror films and I would even consider three of them favorites of mine, but the reason they are good is not for their characters or plot.
     
  8. Body Boy

    Body Boy Well-Known Member

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    Part 1 has more to it. The characters are secondary to the setting, which along with Jason is the catalyst to what people consider the curse. It's not really a curse but the deranged minds of Pamela and in turn the townspeople and teenagers create it. Jason isn't alive but Alice succumbs to his existence like his mother before. It's about repression and ignorance of past events in a new generation. Seeing and knowing things are two separate actions, where both Pamela and Alice know what reality is, but fall victim to delusions just the same. "Steve should never have opened this place again, there's been too much trouble here." "Then he's still there..."

    As for the sequels... I can't think of anything intelligent that they're saying tbh. I still love most of the earlier ones though.
     
  9. ThisEvilBastard

    ThisEvilBastard Banned Mofo

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    Yeah but their's still character's and plot with scares in them.
     
  10. Grim

    Grim Well-Known Member

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    There are characters, but they are weak, one dimensional characters. The plots aren't exactly strong either. Not to mention the original film has one of the cheapest killer reveals ever. The audience has absolutely no way of surmising who the killer is. Hell, Pamela Voorhees' name isn't even mentioned until she introduces herself. I agree with Body Boy's assertion about the setting being catalyst for the events, but the events it causes aren't anything new or original, even in 1980.
     
  11. Body Boy

    Body Boy Well-Known Member

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    I think that the characters are pretty strong actually. I've always identified with most of them, like Jack, Marcie, Brenda and Bill. The killer reveal is definitely cheap, but at the same time we had a road toward it. It didn't hit me until I watched it again recently and Enos mentions the boy drowning in 57, the murders in 58. We've seen the prologue with the two murders in 1958, but what was the purpose of mentioning something before what we saw? Unless... it was important. Because it didn't affect us/we didn't see it, like how the murders were no-news to the 1979 teenagers, we passed it off. But the 1957 event was the important part we skipped over, because we assumed that it was filler talk when we shouldn't have. The killer being "randomly thrown in" at the end does seem like a cheat, and in most other films I would think it was silly, but by a stroke of coincidence (I don't think a lot of what makes F13 work in depth is intentional, so lucky for you Cunningham :p) the sudden appearance of an unknown killer shows how beyond understanding the situation is to the new counselors. Lightning in a bottle for sure. I could write an entire paper on the underlying themes and purpose of Friday the 13th. Lightning in a bottle. But it's a lucky accident. As much as I like the sequels (not nearly as much as Part I) I can't find any level of depth to work with. Part V has its possibilities with the town being crazier than those in the looney bin. I could try to work on that. But the first one is the only one I'd classify as genius, even if by fluke.
     
  12. deepred

    deepred Member

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    Part 3 gets very deep with Chris almost being raped by Jason. I found her character and experiences very real - especially how she feels haunted by her past and cannot let it go. I don't think a character was as well rounded as Chris till Claire in Silence of the Lambs.
     
  13. DVD-fanatic-9

    DVD-fanatic-9 And the Next Morning, When the Campers Woke Up...

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    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t4ONk88Xln4 (35:29)

    I was pretty close.
     
  14. ThisEvilBastard

    ThisEvilBastard Banned Mofo

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    Yeah they all have some depth not just death to them.

    Part 1 is a who done it film
    Part 2 ginny uses her child psychology on Jason
    Part 3 is the nightmares we keep inside us can destroy us
    Part 4 is Tommy's world get's used against him
    Part 5 is a rip off of Part 1
    Part 6 is a Killing the demon's may not be the best option
    Part 7 is that your mind can help you do anything
    Part 8 is that you will always be around monsters of all kinds
    Part 9 is that you need some horror to get back your love
    Part 10 is space is a good ride
    Part 11 is nothng
     
  15. Body Boy

    Body Boy Well-Known Member

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    Oh, I was expecting something completely verbatim, since tits and blood is a generic phrase for stereotyping horror films. Thanks for the clip though.

    Ummm...

    Part 2 and the psychology of a killer with a childlike mind could be one.

    Part 3, as mentioned before, was good with the rape scene. I totally forgot about that. There may be some stretching that can be done for that one as well.

    Part 4... I think the Tommy's world thing is interesting, and his transformation may be taking back his world. But this is probably pushing it.

    Part 5 is more than a copycat. It has a warped direction and as I've already said, the people outside the loony bin are more fucked than inside. People are victims within and outside of it. Jason is dead, but his evil can't really be contained with a label. The spirit of Jason (not literal!) lives on in others. You can label something a halfway house but say that crazies live there, but as with Roy and some of the nutjobs elsewhere, maybe evil isn't so clearly subdued or pointed out. Tommy is supposed to be the survivor, but by the end even he is disturbed.

    Part 6 may have something to do returning to the root of the problem. Tommy's journey to take Jason back to the lake where it all began. This actually fits in nicely with the Part 1 theory that I've posted in that remembering the past may save the outcome. But other than that opening line there's little else to support it beyond Hollywood-ized entertainment.

    Part 7 has a childhood trauma too. Yay! Too bad it's hack-directed. :( The telekinesis dialogue is ripe with interpretation. Like Parts 4 and 6 though, it may not have enough to make it work.

    Part 8 is a film I give more credit for than most people. It's not nearly as terrible as people say. I can't think of something to fit it at this time though.

    Part 9 ... I don't know guys, it feels like a quick fan production, and it looks it. I'd state a theory but I don't think it would be anything more than stupid.

    Part 10... well Evil Bastard said it best, "good ride", aka, nothing beyond its script. That's not depth, that's entertainment. And not my idea of it either.

    Part 11 has evil vs evil. The bad can sometimes counter the bad. Thing is the series has been made by fans since Jason Lives, whereas the first five are made by signed on directors. As it goes on I see less and less underlying structure, or even potential therein.

    Part 12 ... it took elements from 1-4 without understanding the context. It's a mess and I can't make sense of it this way.
     
  16. deepred

    deepred Member

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    I agree with your sentiments on the F13 series, particularly "the series has been made by fans since Jason Lives, whereas the first five are made by signed on directors" and "That's not depth, that's entertainment. And not my idea of it either." :lol:
     
  17. zbinks

    zbinks Beset by Creatures of the Deep

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    Part 8 is yet another childhood trauma film... this time revolving around Rennie, her uncle, a young Jason and Rennie's resistance to learning how to swim.

    Part 11 could be viewed as "The enemy of my enemy is my friend... even if he might want to chop my head off without giving it a second thought."
     
  18. Spacetraveler

    Spacetraveler Member

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    I voted for Friday the 13th. I wish they would make a sequel that ignores all the New Line Jason movies plus the remake and picks up where 8 left off with the movie starting in Manhattan.
     
  19. Grim

    Grim Well-Known Member

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    I never glossed over Enos mentioning the boy drowning in 57 and the murders in 58, as they certainly were meant to be linked to the "curse", along with the fires and the water being "bad", but I still think there's really no way for the audience to surmise that Mrs. Voorhees is the killer until she goes into her psycho rant. It could have worked better, I feel, if Mrs. Voorhees had had an onscreen presence in at least one other scene in the film (which I think they attempted to do with Roy in Part V, but even then they were a bit too heavy-handed and sloppy with the creepy stares the little comments he makes), just to establish her as a character and a possible suspect. As for the characters in the original, I think there was definitely potential to explore some depth, what with Alice and Steve's relationship that is hinted at, but that's all wasted by having Steve leave the group and stay in town. I realize that Steve is probably the only other possible red herring in the original film besides Crazy Ralph, but there definitely could have been more weight to that if he had stayed with the counselors, possibly setting up a jilted ex-lover scenario as he sees Alice and Bill interacting. Still, there's really no point in discussing what could have made the film better at this point as it's been done and completed for well over 30 years. I like your idea of Mrs. Voorhees' sudden appearance demonstrating how out of touch with everything the counselors are.

    I should rephrase what I stated about the characters, though. It's not that there are no strong characters, I just feel every film that had a strong character or two usually killed them off way too early or just downplayed their significance in the plot. The spotlight is typically on a cardboard cut-out. There have been exceptions, though, such as Tommy Jarvis. They could have done so much more with the possible rape thing in Part 3, but it's just thrown in there so late in the film that it just seems kind of absurd.

    On another note, this has all got me wanting to revisit the first four entries again.
     
  20. DVD-fanatic-9

    DVD-fanatic-9 And the Next Morning, When the Campers Woke Up...

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    A Spoiler below, but you all should have seen the movie already so I'm not veiling or coding it.

    As a fan of the franchise, I consider those 3 statements insulting.


    I also like A New Beginning a lot. It has the basic problem of choosing to make the characters mentally/emotionally/psychologically damaged and then tossing that out the window at random intervals, just to get them to follow cliché. It also half-fails at resurrecting the surreal, mind-blurring endings from the first 3 films.

    But, it's actually, genuinely, very funny. Ethel especially is easily funnier than anything in Jason Lives.


    In-tres-ting...

    A. You must think pretty poorly of the Nightmare on Elm Street series.
    B. You must think much more highly of The Dream Child than I do. Or, perhaps anyone else on Earth.

    No franchise sequel tried harder and failed more admirably than The Dream Master. In fact, it's only the casting that holds the film back from being The Definitive Horror Alice in Wonderland. Casting is the main problem for Jason Lives but nowhere near as big an issue, since just about no part of the story is taking itself seriously. The same isn't true for Dream Master.


    HUH?

    (By the way, I do believe the director of the film himself said his father turned him on to horror and when his parents saw Jason Lives, his father was the only one who enjoyed it. Not sure if that helps you or me in this debate but there you go.)

    As for NoES 4... what's necessarily wrong with being commercial? Robert Englund himself said that part of the creative excuse for the sequels was to tap into popular teen culture (especially Mtv) and use it against the characters. Why can't that work?


    Full of? By the time you average the actual onscreen *ca-ching*/cache of the nudity and gore (especially given what was excised between the studio and the MPAA) versus each film's attempts at character and story... Are you sure it's really so wild for people to react to the films as though they have stories? Sure, we all know what the first film was meant to be. And the critics programmed the world to accept their take that the sequels all followed the same template. But who's to say the films really don't have stories? That instead of making the deaths and the killer operate entirely connected to what the characters go through dramatically, they just tell separate stories of people based on observations? How many people have you heard tell you they believe Ginny feels like a real person, for example? When I used to believe that film was one of the weaker in the series, I thought it didn't matter. But, unlike The Final Chapter, this is a very specific reaction people have who stick up for the movie and they've singled her out as why. I'm not sure even Meg from Re-Animator has as many fans.


    That's a bit of a stereotype. The films are extremely crude but it's easy to at least react to the Final Girls as though they're real people with real consequences for what happens to them. At least with Chris, Tina, and Rennie. The rest comes down to the audience liking Ginny and Megan so much - because they were so active in the stories and didn't strike anyone as prudish - that they don't want anything (too) bad to happen to them.


    I'm not sure that was the point. I mean, consider the original Black Christmas. Do you think the point of the movie dropping red herrings on us and putting so much emphasis on us/the characters getting it right was so that we would be upset and frustrated when we discovered that the movie wasn't going to tell us who the killer was?

    The physical presence of the killer alone is what I would guess the point was. Plus, when you consider Mrs. Voorhees was in a sense killing the teens for engaging in socially taboo activities, the abrupt notion that maybe she was a stand-in for parents disapproving of what the characters had been doing all along. If she had had a place in the story, she would have needed to have her motivation telegraphed beforehand. And... none of the other red herring characters had one. Also, remember that Alice does begin to lose her grip on reality more than a little bit in the ending. By movie #2, we're not even supposed to believe Jason was actually under the lake at all.


    Maybe not, but thanks to the setting they were most certainly iconic. In a sense, it was like a gimmick. I.e.: The Funhouse being the first noteworthy horror film taking place in an amusement park / fair / carnival in an attempt to be the definitive literal-thrillride horror film. And it sort-of does work, even though I think Sleepaway Camp is superior, Friday the 13th will always be the definitive summer-camp horror film.


    What about Betty in Opera? There's some pretty damn heavy stuff going on in that story.

    By the way, another thread in the franchise of parental judgment. I've always found Chris to be an underrated character in horror. (Though the movie kinda shoots itself in the foot with some toilet tastelessness and wayward gimmicks; for example- the disco song at the end sure could have used a little tonal foreshadowing, and I don't count the convenience store scene because the quality was very shrill and its use was extremely random. Compare this bit to Jason Lives and the moment where the teens / counselors are literally being given advice by Alice Cooper's theme song playing on their car radio.)


    So was I. But at least now the syrup imagery makes more sense.


    I will never accept that. Filling that detail in without the film making it clear that Jason ever had a sexual interest in stalking his victims (when all he ever did was kill them) is exactly the same as just saying Freddy was a child molestor rather than a torture-killer. Let us continue to be subjective and not state objectively that a character broke from tradition for the purpose of one sequel.


    Part 4 is about how sexuality is a negative thing which turns people into assholes. The filmmakers exploit this to get their own childish kicks from it. This also I will never change my tune on. I'm just as devout a fan as anyone else, have seen the film dozens of times, and have analyzed all 8 (of the interesting films) painstakingly. Time and again. But this movie is really screwed up and if anyone replies, bare my stubbornness in mind- I will never change. This film is cheap shit except for the film's production crew which made it look and sound mostly like canon Friday the 13th.


    I actually look at this movie as being mostly a comedy and wanting to be a very feel-good mystery. I mean, of course there is unpleasantness at times but most of the horny characters have healthy attitudes toward sex and their prospective partners. Unlike Final Chapter, where the instant someone expresses a sexual desire- nastiness, competitiveness, sexism, chauvinism, and other assorted uglinesses immediately follow.


    What about the half of her symptoms/cause involving how alienated she feels from other people?
     

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