Salo - Uncut in the UK! Whatever next?

Listen man, you guys need to chill out. The bloke I E-mailed especially. Man, you need a nice looking girlfriend or something. I can't help it that you're sitting at home as a lonely sad individual. I just kinda tried to brighten up your life a bit with some nice comments.
In case you don't know: I'm winding you up.
Listen folks. It's nice to have a good debate and i'm glad to see you're all getting into the spirit of it. I laid down my line and I guess I'll have to defend it.
Well, here goes... Polanski was with a consenting partner of (and if I'm wrong i'm sorry) 15 or 16. In a lot of countries that's cool anyway (including our own UK). Hey i'm not defending it.
Passolini was actually killed by some young guy he was trying to pick up. He was well known as something of a cruiser I believe. Also some critics have said that Salo throws his own perversions on the audiences lap. I guess that's why I'd feel uncomfortable wathcing it. I'm not into this nor am I into bondage hence I wouldn't watch a bondage video. I don't think ban it... I just wouldn't want to watch it or associate myself with it.
As for the meat thing: I,m half an half. Something of a white meat diet. Don't like vegetables, but won't eat pigs because - yeah i know all about it. There's some morality there. I know the work of many great conversationsits however (I'll give you a list if you wish) and none are veggies. Is that hypocritical? I don't think so. The sea turtle is dying out in Amazonia, and Cannibal Holocasut hacked one up for no reason. Man, it's like just killing an elephant. We have to realise that some species are over exploited and need our protection. Look at the world - it's a delicate balance and 90 percent of living things exist in the tropical rainforest. That's a balance we shouldn't be fucking with. Breeding cows or whatever for our own use... well, that's the way we've come to survive (regardless, indeed, over whether I eat beef or not). Look, I couldn't be a doctor or a dentist - I just don't like stuff like real blood or anything like that. Hence, I probably couldn't work in a slaughterhouse either.
Anyway, if you really don't think a horror movie is worthwhile unless a turtle is hacked up then... I dunno. That does woory me. Call me a prude if you want.
That's my say for now.

[joltaddict]

Originally posted by Mark Relford:
when it comes to name calling and other forms of negativity, then you're not welcome here.

If you want him to leave you could just tell him the Mods of this forum enjoy sex with children then he would have to leave (according to his previous posts).

Hey, thats not a bad idea, any of you mods wanna take one for the team?

I'm going to stick my toe into the water and see if something bites my leg off...

I'll start by pointing out that "pedophilia" is the American spelling, vs. our good friend from the UK's added vowels ("honours"). (I, too, have an honors degree in an English field, and I have a dictionary.)

I'll finish by offering up my own, personal quasi-common-sense approach to controversial stuff: If you don't like it, don't watch it. Don't pay for it, don't support it, even protest it. If we all ignore it, it will go away. If it breaks laws, the perp will be punished. You don't like Salo, why even give it the dignity of reference - all you're likely to do is encourage people to see it or give it more attention than (you believe) it deserves. My 2-2.5 cents. Maybe it works, maybe it doesn't.

And I've never seen the movie, don't really care to, can't afford it if I wanted to, am afraid to ask if it's any good, know nothing about the director and haven't engaged in any sex acts with anyone under 18 since I was a minor, too.

And I own a dog and love a good steak.

In case you don't know: I'm winding you up.
Listen folks. It's nice to have a good debate and i'm glad to see you're all getting into the spirit of it.

You don't need to wind people up by insulting them or questioning their morality. Debates are a good thing - even if they become extreme - but not when you start one via personal flames. Most people come to the web discussions to get away from that kind of thing in the newsgroups (which have become nothing but flame wars and troll breeding grounds).

Well, here goes... Polanski was with a consenting partner of (and if I'm wrong i'm sorry) 15 or 16. In a lot of countries that's cool anyway (including our own UK). Hey i'm not defending it.

This is where your point of morality falls apart. You cannot make this distinction because it is convenient. Polanski did molest a child. He's no different than Pasolini (except in terms of the number of offenses). At what age is the moral line drawn? And who decides that age?

I don't know how old you are, but I'm 31 and looking back at 16 I do not believe all decisions I made in regards to women were correct (regardless of what I thought at the time). A 16 year old is not necessarily psychologically mature enough to consent to sex with an adult. That's why laws against it are in place in many countries - to protect such children against making mistakes because they may not know any better and can be easily manipulated.

Either way, I see no difference between what any of these people did. And saying it's OK in some countries and not others only further enforces why no one should be judging the morality of it. Different cultures have different beliefs. Historically speaking, 12 was once considered prime marrying age in some societies.

Just for the record, Polanski was convicted of raping a 13 year old girl. Chaplin married two 16 year old girls - once when he was 28 and again when he was 35.

Also some critics have said that Salo throws his own perversions on the audiences lap.

Well, it is his film - so why shouldn't it reflect his views (perverted or otherwise)? If the audience doesn't like it, they can leave. I did.

I guess that's why I'd feel uncomfortable wathcing it. I'm not into this nor am I into bondage hence I wouldn't watch a bondage video. I don't think ban it... I just wouldn't want to watch it or associate myself with it.

I'm not comfortable with such things either. In fact, I can't even watch a movie with a rape scene in it. That's one of the few things that can really disturb me. But I still don't tell others they should not watch such films or imply there is some moral issue at large. I think I'm a good person, but that doesn't qualify me to judge someone elses beliefs or opinions.

As for the meat thing: I,m half an half. Something of a white meat diet. Don't like vegetables, but won't eat pigs because - yeah i know all about it. There's some morality there.

This is more than an issue of morality, it's one of contradiction. You cannot say "save the animals" while your fridge is stuffed with their dead carcasses. The vast majority of animal rights activists are very hypocritical on this point. Life is life. Endangered species have no more or less a right to protection than farm animals. I'm sure if given the choice of extinction or being raised for slaughter, most animals would rather just die off. At least the poor creatures that were hunted into oblivion weren't all tortured for years before being killed.

Breeding cows or whatever for our own use... well, that's the way we've come to survive (regardless, indeed, over whether I eat beef or not).

We could evolve beyond this if we wanted to. You don't need meat to survive in any "advanced" country. It's more a matter of want these days. After seeing what animals were put though just to provide me with something that tastes good, I couldn't justify eating meat any longer. I get physically ill just thinking about the suffering that goes on. I'd rather suffer myself than be a part of it all. Others could make the same choice if it really bothered them.

In any case, no meat eater has the right to cry over killing animals in films. That is blatant hypocracy. The saddest thing is that people don't even think about it because meat is just something you pick up at the market and you don't have to deal with how it got there. As many have said over the years: if all people had to kill their own food, the majority would proably be strict vegeterians.

Anyway, if you really don't think a horror movie is worthwhile unless a turtle is hacked up then...

I don't think anyone here would ever say that - at least I hope not. Thinking that way might mean someone is genuinely clinically disturbed. Most serial killers started out wanting to see animals killed.

squiggy, for God's sake stop encouraging him!!??

though i gotta say that 'spunk for brains' was pretty good. is that a scotish expression? Ha!

All right, having stuck my toe out, now I'm gonna stick my neck out...

Originally posted by Squiggy:
In any case, no meat eater has the right to cry over killing animals in films. That is
blatant hypocracy.

IN MY OPINION (take note! just my opinion), I think there's a difference between an animal killed for sustenance and one killed for sport or entertainment. (Yeah, I like a good steak. Heck, I'm practically a carnivore.)

Doesn't mean I won't buy Cannibal Ferox. Doesn't mean I will.

Doesn't mean I hate Squiggy. Doesn't mean I'm right and he's wrong. Just means I disagree.

[Mark Relford]

"Meat's meat and a man's gotta eat!"
-Farmer Vincent (Motel Hell)

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"Have you ever had an Egyptian feast?"

"They're back from the grave and ready to party!"

[joltaddict]

Originally posted by AceRimRat:
I think there's a difference between an animal killed for sustenance and one killed for sport or entertainment. (Yeah, I like a good steak. Heck, I'm practically a carnivore.)
Doesn't mean I won't buy Cannibal Ferox.

They do eat the turtle in question, the other rat thing is eaten by a snake. The entertainment is a by-product

[Mark Relford]

Oops! Sorry for the double post.


[This message has been edited by Mark Relford (edited 12-27-2000).]

Well I'm gonna shock you all and say I reckon you all have a point. I agree with every one of you guys. I think you're very right about the meat thing. A lot of us would be strict veggies. As for Salo - if I didn't like it I'd leave. I was dissapointed my New York ripper post was taken down as this constitutes censorship does it not? I was merely expressing an opinion on that one! However, I can see it might have offended some people and I guess that needs an apology.
I'll see Salo in given time, but in the mean time as I said: You've all got points that I agree with here. As for the guy who left... yeah, I can see that this is the best thing to do in the case of a film like that. I'm just more excited about other films being excited since our country softened up its censorship laws and i'm definately looking forward to Zombi holocaust and its like. However, if I can start a new topic - isn't it about time we softened up on Last House on the Left, one of the most frightening films ever?
Cheers guys, it's been fun (whatever you think of my opinions)

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www.lundwood.u-net.com/fl/firelightshocks.html CHECK US OUT!

[joltaddict]

They're saying "I reckon" in England now?

A belated welcome, CR.

Thanks man, i'm actually Scottish though so I'm unsure of what they use in England!!! I'll probably end up dragging my girlfriend to watch Salo as soon as it gets its cinema release over here in early January. I'm curious after all that arguing as to HOW nasty it really is. That aside, and in reference to my last E mail to this site, I just thought I'd alert people to the fact that Last House on the Left has been released on a really impressive anamorphically enhanced French DVD and that I've got a fullr eview of the new two DVD Dawn of the Dead release on my site (which contains Argneto's European cut and a widescreen version of Romero's cut alongside a ton of extras).
hope this is of some use to someone out there!
Calum

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www.lundwood.u-net.com/fl/firelightshocks.html CHECK US OUT!

[DVD Connoisseur]

Yep, they say "I reckon" in little ol' England as well!

Calum, you aren't seriously taking your girlfriend to see Salo? Urgh! That's the least likely "date" movie I can think of! (I just know somebody's going to now suggest an even worse date movie, but you get the drift!)

[joltaddict]

Originally posted by DVD Connoisseur:
(I just know somebody's going to now suggest an even worse date movie, but you get the drift!)

Ohh! Ohh! I know! I Spit on Your Grave.

[Jason25]

C.R. - I took your post down in the Euro Horror forum because it was pure garbage. It is one thing to discuss things and it is another to say things for shock value and to entice an arguement. I have no problem with people discussing meaningful topics but when someone resorts to personal attacks then I draw the line. That's why your post was deleted. You are more than welcome to post again there, as you have, and your other posts were not deleted. I just won't put up with people who attack people personally.
I hope you post as many topics as you like in the Euro horror forum, but please consider the opinions of others. Thanks.